Are we responding to your needs!

[otooleg]

An important point for discussion before for the AGM!
Guys at this time of year I always start to think what am I getting out of the camera club?

I am mindful that our club is fairly unique in trying to respond to the requirements of all camera levels - the Beginner through to the Professional. Therefore, it can be difficult at times, to ensure we hit the mark with either internal or external events. At this time of year we get the opportunity to discuss this topic before we make arrangements for next year. Gordon is trying to cater to the needs of the club members, but if you don't tell him what you would like to see, then he cannot respond.

This Forum, and indeed the AGM, and I suppose our other venue - The Black Bull, is where you get the opportunity to discuss what you would like to see in Your club. I stress the your club because that is what it is - but if you do not contribute to the discussion then we cannot cater for your requirements.

It is a personal thing, but I still think we have far to much emphasis on competitions, this is historical and is because we not only have internal club competitions but also inter club competitions. I accept that we have to have competitions - because how else can you know if your standards are improving (although you could ask of course), but for the people in the middle ground, what I call intermediate level photographers, it must be frustrating to never be able to win the overall competitions due to the skill levels of our more senior members - although remember if you don't enter - you can't win. - Guilty as charged, - though I was ill!

I have stressed that I personally get far more out of helping my fellow members, than I do in winning any competition. That is of course my personal view, but I learn from club members just like you learn hopefully from me. I would like to see far more emphasis on skills transfer, this would also benefit our competition levels by bringing on our beginners. More practical nights, and with the lighter nights - lets get out there and take photographs.

All of this is of course my personal views, you can disagree if you wish, but tell me, and more importantly Gordon, so that he can reflect this in the syllabus. If we don't listen you have the ultimate sanction - a vote at the AGM.

I hope this will stimulate debate?

Kindest regards - and I'll get off my soapbox now!

George

[Dougie]

You can't beat hands-on. For me it's the only you learn how to get the most out of something. I'm all for practical nights, whether it's studio, macro, etc. We have varying levels of expertise at this club, and photography is one of those subjects where you learn something new everyday! I agree with you George on what you say.
One thing could I suggest, within the next few weeks, we will be coming into more light in the evenings. Mid Calder is a very photogenic village. What about one evening, we use the village as a theme night. Or perhaps meeting at another location, ie, Almondell (for instance) for, say, "wildlife in the evening" theme. We could put together a list of local locations we could visit for something like this!
Wow, I've got a headache now, that was heavy going........................

[Linda]

First of all thanks George for opening this up for debate.  This year has been my first experience of any camera club so I have no idea about what has happened before or what happens anywhere else and sometimes unless the right questions are asked, the right answers are never found 

I also appreciate it must be very difficult trying to meet everyone’s needs when there is such a wide range of skills and abilities within the club.

I feel I have learned a lot from my time with the club but I am even more aware of how much I don’t know.  I would appreciate more practical evenings, whether inside or out, both on how to take better photos and also using photoshop. 

I know we have dvd’s for various bits of that but sometimes it’s easier just to ask ‘how do you?’ and someone explains or shows you how. 

I also appreciate the less formal evenings when I can ask questions which might seem very basic and silly in any other setting, but where I know someone will be able to explain or point me in the right direction, without me feeling foolish.

I too will now swiftly alight from the arena, before I do make a fool of myself 

[otooleg]

Alright then, thank you for the initial comments but I really need more from the rest of the membership, do we have a majority of the membership willing to embrace the wind of change? We are asking for a change in priority away from competitions to more skills transfer. Without the majority wanting a more positive balance in favour of subject followed by practical nights, rather than competitions, then it isn't going to change!

It's up to you guys. If you ask Gordon to take this on board, then I am sure he will deliver.

My last words on the subject - till the AGM anyway.

Regards

George

[Stuart R]

Hi all

Well, most of you already know my point of view as to how I would like to see MCCC move forward. My ideal format for the future would be (in a typical 4 week month)
Week 1. -  Lecture or Demonstration from outside Lecturer (Chick Calder on Photoshop or similiar??)
Week 2. Demonstration of some photographic subject (macro/Still/ Plant/ Landscape or Night) - and THEN MEMBERS ARE ASKED TO GO OUT AND TAKE SOME IMAGES BEFORE THE NEXT WEEK!
Week 3 - MEMBERS BRING THEIR IMAGE WITH THEM ON A STICK (CLUB COULD BUY SOME IF NEEDED - NOW AS CHEAP AS CHIPS) - then showing and discussion on the results - Constructive Crit ONLY!!
Week 4 - compo night!

If more time is need for the practical of Week 2, then weeks 3 & 4 swap and we review images on week 4.

Duing the Summer months, we should have one organised Club outing per month to practice what we have learned and to encourage fellowship within the club - Botanics/Red kites/Orchids/ or other events as per Deb's outings

Thanks my 2p worth

Cheers

Stuart

[GordonS]

Thanks to George for starting this discussion going althugh I feel that the two topics are quite similar in nature and perhaps should have been all together.

Anyways here are my thoughts on the year so far and my thoughts on what people have said.

I feel that the semi "structured "approach has worked quite well excepting the problems we encounter on the first Wed of the month. I would like to try and continue it next year. Stuarts suggestion about the structure is quite a good one. 1st Speaker 2nd,3rd Practical/Demo nights and a Competition on the 4th/last Wed of the month

I have looked at two local clubs Livingston and Midlothian and roughly counted what they have done over the current year. Our figure is first, Livi 2nd ML 3rd

Club Competition Nights          6, 6, 5
Inter Club Comps                   3, 4, 5
Speakers                              5, 12, 10
Practical/Demos                     11, 8, 7

Plus Misc nights various

You can see from these figures that we have a similar number of competitions and slightly less speakers and more practical nights.
I am not suggesting for one minute that just because another club does something we should be doing the same.
George feels that we have too many competitions but from these two local clubs you can see we are doing about the same and a quick look around other sites suggests similar numbers with other clubs and occasionally more. But I do think that we will def take on board what members want and decrease ( or increase ) if thats what people want. My opinion is that I feel we have the number about right. But I will start another topic soon asking member for their input about our competitions.

[otooleg]

Thanks for the response Gordon - now come on you lot, if you want change you have to say so!

I think we can learn from the sats you have shown, though I find it hard to comprehend the number of practical nights shown - unless you are including in your figures for our summer trips out? You know what they say about statistics!

Regards
George

[Dougie]

I believe we should keep the competitions with other clubs, it doesn't just raise our own personal standards, but that of the club as well. I think we have enough competitions for the time being.
I suggested earlier about meeting up at an agreed locations for theme nights, ie at Almondell. We should take advantage of the light evenings. Theme's such as Mid Calder (probably been done to death), street photography, a disused factory, etc. I would say there seems to be a healthy discussion in hand for the AGM!

[Gidders]

Getting a bit confused at all the threads we seem to have . This past year I have missed a number of meetings ( and competitions) for various reasons. The views that seem to be coming through is that we require to look at the number of competitions. Here are my thoughts
Competitions Reduce number by one - Keep using outside assessors

Inter club competitions Entries to be the winners of the club competitions plus those entries that are in the score range 17 upwards or the next levels down depending on scoring/numbers required. This would mean that we do not require selection nights for interclub competitions which are a repeat of what we have seen

Practical Evenings - I believe this is what the new member is looking for in the first instance and why they join a club. Taking shots, showing them to others on the big screen and listening to a critique, obtaining guidance is the foundation to progressing to the competition environment. Assign a 'buddie' to new members ?

Presentations - Talks such as Laurie Campbell and local 'professionals' are inspiring and should be regular features on the syllabus

Ouside Work - A timetable of outside Wed evening photos sessions from May to Sept should be set up . I am happy to organise another night at Malleny Gardens in mid June when all the border flowers will be out as well as access to the greenhouse.

New Members - Great to see the numbers increasing. Must ensure we retain new members. Talk to them and see what they want from the club . A suggestion - in addition to the badge that Willie prepared could we have a lapel badge with our name on it so we know who we are speaking to - I am terrible for remembering names. 

[GordonS]

FYI

Statistics for club and other clubs are from official meetings and do not include summer outings etc

[Linda]

Thank goodness it is not just me who can't remember names!  I like the idea of name badges, as the club continues to gain new members then this will probably become even more neccessary.  Perhaps we could have the website/forum showing members pics with their names as well?


Re the syllabus - I like the idea of a demo/lecture followed by a practical session and the evaluation of our own images based on this.

As a new member I expected to have more hands on/how to take good photos/how to improve photos than there has been.  That's not to say I haven't enjoyed the club or learned from it but speaking to others who are interested but not ready to make a commitment I know they are looking for that practical aspect of things too.

[Grahamg]

I think the idea of a demo night followed by a hands on night is a good way forward.  The approach of having set nights in the month for speakers, competitions demos and practicals is a good one.